Obama vs. Clinton in Texas

It's Barack Obama vs. Hillary Clinton, live from Texas and in front of an exciteable audience. They get opening statements, Clinton tries to humanize herself, Obama is nervous as he usually is at the start, a bit rough for him (yeah, this is just like blogging American Idol!)

First question is on Cuba, from Jorge Ramos of Univision, whether they'd talk to Raul Castro. Clinton says yes, after he earns it; Obama says yes, it's worth taking a risk to try and change that relationship. His key point is especially after George Bush, America can't put ourselves above the rest of the world and tell them they have to earn the right to talk to us, we have to take the extra step and try to change the dynamics of the world. It's a good answer.

Second, John King asks what's the difference between you guys on the economy? Obama talks about his tax policies, none of which seem like anything Clinton wouldn't also support. Then he brings up trade deals... waiting for him to mention NAFTA... he doesn't, pivots to talking about creating a green economy. He essentially closes with we're similar on a lot of these things, but I can get the change done and Clinton can't.

Surprisingly Clinton doesn't hit Obama right away, lays out her policies--including she wants to create a trade prosecutor to enforce these agreements. She's very specific, will freeze foreclosures; gets big applause for going after Bush's war on science.

Immigration is next, Ramos again--would you stop these raids that are tearing apart families. Clinton says yes, she'd consider it; it's horrible, and un-American. She'd go after employers who take advantage of illegal immigrants, and would work with Mexico to create jobs there; we need a path to legalization. It's a good, comprehensive answer, not much room left for Obama. She's clearly got the momentum tonight, is speaking confidently and strongly.

Obama says he'd add a few things to what Clinton said, has worked on comprehensive immigration reform as well. First, we need to tone down the ugly rhetoric--we're a nation of laws, and of immigrants, and we can reconcile those two things. We need stronger border security, crackdown on employers but without discriminating against all Hispanics. And we need to make sure the path to citizenship doesn't reward lawbreakers. And we need to fix the system so the backlog for legal immigration isn't so long; and we have to improve our relationship with Mexico. Odd, he doesn't mention his own personal ties to immigration, wonder why not.

King asks Clinton about the border fence with Mexico and whether she'd speed up progress on it or stop it. She says she'd review it, and listen to the people who live along the border. She pushes for smart fencing, instead of a physical barrier--calls Bush's policies dumb. She's very strident, always speaks at full volume.

Obama says they entirely agree--consult with local communities. Bush isn't good at listening. He pivots and says we need to also deal with the people who are already here. He doesn't mention his dad at all; wants to let kids who have grown up here to get education, big applause when he says he doesn't want two classes of people.

Ramos again, a ton of people speak Spanish here--is there a downside to this country becoming bilingual? Clinton says it's important for Americans to learn another language, which she says she's never been able to do. We should all be unified by English, but let's not make it the official language.

Obama says everyone should learn a second language; so odd he's not talking about his own background, not even his ability to speak other languages. Takes a swipe at No Child Left Behind.

John King, back from break--why are you guys being so nice tonight? Asks Clinton if Obama is all hat, no cattle, and can you say that after the last 45 minutes. She says she has indeed said it about Bush; Obama and I have a lot in common but there are differences. She's speaking very carefully now, it's interesting how deliberately she's trying not to sound negative. Brings up how one of Obama's supporters couldn't name any accomplishments by Obama. So there's her dig....

Obama calmly listens, then says he's acted a lot in his career, starts listing things, speaking over the applause; hits Clinton for slamming Obama's wins and endorsements and momentum, mentions every paper in Texas has backed him--they're not all being duped, they perceive the reality of Washington's current climate very accurately. It's a key moment in the debate, he goes on that the reason he's done so well is it's not just about policy positions; you also have to inspire people to get involved, to go beyond divisions, otherwise you get more gridlock and families suffer as a result. Big applause that goes on.

Campbell Brown raises the plagiarism issue. He says look, it's two lines out of a lot of speeches, I've been running for two years now (oh, really?!) He says it's silly to say I've plagiarized from one of my co-chairs, who gave me the line and suggested I use it; it's the silly season people don't like. Man, he's seized the momentum in the debate; starts listing specifics from his speeches, Brown tries to cut him off, he says to finish, these are specific, concrete and detailed, let's not tear each other down, let's lift the country up.

Clinton says if your candidacy is about words, they should be your own words. It's not change you can believe in, it's change you can Xerox. He interjects, crowd boos, she gets tough--Barack, this is important.... We have to unite the country for a purpose, around specific goals. The tone in the debate has shifted again; her applause line about Xerox is going to get looped along with the boos.

Hits him on health care, then on foreclosures--we all know we have to join together, let's look hard at what we have to do. He wants to jump in, she keeps going, he's got that look on his face. Clinton brings up her '93 fight for healthcare like it's a badge of honor.

Obama purposefully says let's talk about the issues where we disagree; she liked my health plan earlier, now she doesn't. She keeps staring at him when he's speaking, it's weird. He's listing his health care plan specifics--get to the line about her garnishing people's wages. Finally; he says it's not universal cause it's not affordable. He says he admires her attempt to bring healthcare reform in '93--it's just the way they did it before closed doors made it hard for people to cooperate. Ah, brings it back to how none of this stuff will happen unless we change Washington.

They go to break over Clinton's trying to jump back in. Wow, that was the key moment--Obama came off better, I think, by just ignoring her attacks and being boringly specific.

Ramos asks Clinton if Obama's ready to be commander-in-chief; she says she thinks she is, let's go back to health care, it's a substantive difference. She says we'll all pay a hidden tax if we don't mandate it, quotes John Edwards that it'd be like if Social Security was voluntary.

Obama jumps back, winds up being allowed to be brief--Clinton's mandate is on individuals not government; it doesn't work in Massachussetts--people are paying a fine, and they still can't afford to pay for it. A harsh stiff penalty--Clinton wants to go after people's wages; we both want it, the difference is how to get there.

Clinton jumps back in, this is too important, it's the top issue people talk to us about. Obama keeps raising his finger to jump back in as Clinton hammers on him. Obama basically says adults will be able to make choices under my plan, it's not true 15 million will be left out.

Ramos tries again on commander-in-chief, what do you mean. She talks about her own experiences, there's a lot going on in the world. It's interesting, she goes on about the importance of presidential leadership--this all feeds into Obama's arguments, and he certainly seems tough enough tonight to negotiate with other countries.

Obama says I wouldn't run if I didn't think I was ready. My top job is to keep the American people safe. Talks about a lot of families in Texas who have people on multiple tours of duty because of Bush's poor planning. He brings up the war in Iraq--on the top choice of our decision, I showed the proper judgment, and I believe Clinton was wrong. It diverted attention from Afghanistan. He lists how he was right in Iraq, right on Pakistan on how we need to go after terrorists without depending on Musharraf; I've shown the judgment to lead.

King asks, wasn't the surge the right decision--isn't it better off today than it was before? Clinton says the Iraqi government hasn't made progress; Obama gave a great answer on this in New Hampshire, let's see what he says here; she's just going on about how the surge really hasn't done that well. She ignores her wrong vote on Iraq; says it's not in anyone's interest for us to stay there.

Obama takes a different tack--it's indisputable that we've seen the violence gone down, credits a local Texas unit. It's a tactical victory on top of a huge strategic blunder. It'll be easier for me to debate McCain on Iraq, than Clinton's tactical arguments. Our entire aid to Latin America is about how much we spend in Iraq in a week. The burden on the American people is huge, he's on a roll now, listing problem after problem related to the war in Iraq and veterans--the fact that we're spending $12 billion a month in Iraq hamstrings us in every other area. Brings up McCain's 100 years line; hits him on not understanding the economy--big applause as he finshes. Wow, Clinton got creamed there, she's just sitting there smiling.

Back from break, curious what the candidates do; Brown gets in a plug for CNN's post-debate coverage. King asks Obama about earmarks, claims he hasn't disclosed his $90M in earmarks. Obama says it's not true, we've disclosed it all, we can get you a copy. Plugs his google for government database. This is a softball for him, really, Obama's very good on this issue.

Clinton gets asked a long question by King about McCain's stance of taking no earmarks; she just goes after the Bush administration's bad fiscal policy, we borrow money from the Chinese to buy oil from the Saudis. Totally dodges King's question, asks where has the money gone under Bush. Let's go back to the 90s, when things were working well.

Campos asks about superdelegates. Clinton dodges it, it'll sort itself out, we'll be unified and we'll win. And that's it. Obama says these primaries and caucuses need to count for something--the will of the voters will determine the nominee. He's no pushover, goes on to say it's most important to the voters that we have a government which is listening to them again, they feel like they've been shut out. They don't get a sense that the debates in Washington relate to them at all, people are trying to score points, win elections. I have no doubt that the Democratic party at its best can summon a higher purpose for the American people, I'm going to give them their government back.

Wow, that's it--last question. Brown asks about judgment during a time of crisis. Obama says no single moment--the trajectory of my life. Tells his bio. What was most important was learning to take responsibility for my own actions, and how I can bring people together. Organizer, civil rights attorney, that cumulative experience is what I bring. Kind of flat applause afterwards.

Clinton says everyone here knows I've lived through some crises and some challenging moments, gets big applause. She makes a good point, everything I've gone through is nothing compared to the American people's problems. Launches into a stock anecdote, opening of a medical center in Texas, just her and McCain. It's so staged, maudlin. Oh, she's getting a bit emotional; hits I've taken in life are nothing compared to the wounded soldiers there. Big applause drowns out here end, as she talks about wanting to help motivates her; oh, she goes--I'm honored to be here, they shake hands as she says this.

It's her best moment of the night, she seems to be speaking from her heart, this is about the American people. The audience stands and applauds, candidates sit and acknowledge. Brown says a standing ovation, closes, the two shake hands, Obama shakes hands with the panel, Chelsea comes up with Hillary; Brown runs a commercial, Obama shakes her hand, and that's it.

It was a good debate; Obama did well, Clinton as well. Obama wins by virtue of not messing up; afterwards, he's mobbed by the audience, she's got a lot of people around her too. He was smart in that he was a bit boring, and anyone who reads the transcript would probably see his well-thought-out responses.

David Gergen, who I like, just said on CNN he thought Clinton's best moment was her last one. Candy Crowley thought Clinton's worst moment was getting booed on the xerox line. Wow, this is just like Idol, complete with judges to compare my responses with.

Jeffrey Toobin thinks the last remarks by Clinton was a bit valedictory, that she's going to leave on the high ground--hmmm, interesting.

This election's been over for a while; going point by point over who won each section of the debate is pointless. Even if Obama makes a major gaffe at some point in the next 10 days, early voting and momentum will carry him through.

Brown afterwards analyzes it like she wasn't there; give us some sense of what it was like up there, sheesh.... She thinks the audience would like to see them together on a ticket; ha!

King says everyone was pretty positive, Clinton in contrast to her stump speech. He mentions backstage he realized she wasn't going to come out and hit him, she walked over to him and they talked warmly beforehand, about their Secret Service agents buying cowboy boots in Texas.

Ultimately, the debate tonight is really for undecided voters, independents and Republicans for the general election. Barack Obama came across as presidential, and believable as commander-in-chief; that's what he needed to do.